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 Is snow nose real?

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kelly.hynum
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PostSubject: Is snow nose real?   Sat Dec 07, 2013 5:38 pm

Does snow nose really exist...Luna has what I think is snow nose. Will her black button nose come back or is the pink in the middle a permanent addition?
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seattlesibe
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PostSubject: Re: Is snow nose real?   Sat Dec 07, 2013 5:56 pm

What do you mean really exist??

Link has had his his whole life. It seems to be permanent.
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WolvenSight
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PostSubject: Re: Is snow nose real?   Sat Dec 07, 2013 6:02 pm

I have never seen a husky or malamute without "snow nose." It is typically lighter in the winter months and darkens up in the warmer months. Although you probably won't notice a change. Also, a dog's nose will get more pink as it ages if they have snow nose.
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PostSubject: Re: Is snow nose real?   Sat Dec 07, 2013 6:12 pm

Lycus' nose is about 95% black during most of the year, but in the winter like now, it DEFINITELY lightens up. I would says it's a 50% black and 50% pink now and when the summer comes in again, it goes black to mostly black.
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Hayden_69
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PostSubject: Re: Is snow nose real?   Sat Dec 07, 2013 6:22 pm

Brandi has a brown nose and since its gotten cold, it's turned pink in the middle. I'm As it warms up, it will go back mostly brown, but the pink will be faintly there.
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seattlesibe
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PostSubject: Re: Is snow nose real?   Sat Dec 07, 2013 7:10 pm

Anyone know what it is though, the how and why?
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Niraya
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PostSubject: Re: Is snow nose real?   Sat Dec 07, 2013 8:56 pm

Just a loss of pigmentation.  Environmental things (most people say plastic bowls are a big cause of it or lack of sunlight) is what I have heard listed most commonly for the causes.

for what it is worth...neither of my two have it both are indoor dogs and both have eaten and drink from plastic dishes.

I am pretty sure there are supplements you can give that help skin/coat care/health that can also help with pigment loss.

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seattlesibe
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PostSubject: Re: Is snow nose real?   Sat Dec 07, 2013 9:02 pm

But isn't the occurrence rate a lot higher in the breed?  And aren't a lot of Huskies born with it?

I was under the impression that there was more to the story with the breed than there is to pigmentation issues on the nose in dogs, generally.  

I swear I can remember, vaguely, reading about it and that "In most dogs this is due to______________, but with Huskies_____________ in a similar way that the occurrence of blue eyes and/or bi-eyes is higher in the breed as well."

confused
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Niraya
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PostSubject: Re: Is snow nose real?   Sat Dec 07, 2013 9:09 pm

I personally have never heard of that but that isn't to say it isnt true.  I dont know much about snow nose because I personally do not care for it.  Another non-statistical, personal observation is that I have seen more show bred dogs with snow noses than I have pet or working bred (that is just in my very small area over here that I have personally seen).


In my limited viewing of puppies I dont think I have ever personally seen a dog born with a snow nose.  I am under the impression that snow nose is something that usually develops later on (the time frame obviously varies)

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seattlesibe
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PostSubject: Re: Is snow nose real?   Sat Dec 07, 2013 9:12 pm

Hmm, that's interesting indeed.

We need a research grant Smile
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seattlesibe
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PostSubject: Re: Is snow nose real?   Sat Dec 07, 2013 9:15 pm

Wikipedia offers no help, but every Husky shown has it.
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Niraya
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PostSubject: Re: Is snow nose real?   Sat Dec 07, 2013 9:15 pm

@seattlesibe wrote:
We need a research grant Smile
Indeed!!!

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Niraya
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PostSubject: Re: Is snow nose real?   Sat Dec 07, 2013 9:18 pm

Well, it would not be a very informative page if it did not show examples of it! Lol

we obviously know that not every siberian develops it...so wikipedia gets a "meh" for the day.

(totally logged onto chat because...yeah. lol)

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seattlesibe
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PostSubject: Re: Is snow nose real?   Sat Dec 07, 2013 9:25 pm

Haha, well said...but it was the breed page Smile

I do know that Link has had it since he was a tiny puppy (coincidentally he has never eaten from a plastic bowl ever), and his sire has it, not his dam.  

I did just see that it is more common in the breed than in dogs generally.  It is most common in white based, northern breeds and that in general with these breeds vets do not generally suspect it to be a health related issue because of no known health risk correlations and an inability to treat it.  

Makes me think there's a genetic component in some cases.
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Playing with the Big Dogs
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PostSubject: Re: Is snow nose real?   Sat Dec 07, 2013 9:32 pm

Is it part of the breed standard? If it's not something you want in a show husky you think the "dog show people" would know. And I am sorry if there is a better way to say that. I can't think of one.

But you think the dog show people. Would know. It would be interesting for one of them to weigh in.
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Niraya
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PostSubject: Re: Is snow nose real?   Sat Dec 07, 2013 9:32 pm

Snow nose is acceptable.

"Nose: Black in gray, tan or black dogs; liver in copper dogs; may be flesh-colored in pure white dogs. The pink-streaked "snow nose" is acceptable. "

Like I said - I really don't know much about it because snow nose isn't my thing.  I really dislike it and hope that my dogs don't develop it lol.  I've heard people say their dogs got it as a result of using plastic bowls (all of my dogs have used plastic bowls - but I've only had three) and once they switched to metal it went away.  I've also been told that getting them out in the sunlight will help too (nothing to back this up as I don't have dogs with it).  I also agree that there is likely some genetic aspect of it as well.

As just a personal observation in my area when I am out at shows I see many a Siberian with snow nose (more with than without).

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seattlesibe
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PostSubject: Re: Is snow nose real?   Sat Dec 07, 2013 9:59 pm

I guess as far as my personal taste I am sort of indifferent about it but I'm sort of bias since my little buddy has one. it's neither here nor there for me.
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GeorginaMay
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PostSubject: Re: Is snow nose real?   Sat Dec 07, 2013 10:28 pm

Just going to throw my two cents worth in here because this interests me, I have never actually met a Husky with a snow nose I really had no idea it was a thing until I became a member on this site Embarassed 
I had a quick browse through the profile listings of current show sibes and out of 41  there are 8 with snow nose, 4 of these are imported dogs, 3 of the nz bred with snow nose have american sires (all innisfree) and only one nz bred with both an nz bred dam and sire has snow nose - and the dam of that bitch is one of the nz bred with american sire. Oh and out of those 8 dogs 6 of them live in an area of nz that has the warmest winters, they would definitely not come in contact with any snow. Perhaps it could be genetic...?
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Mobezilla
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PostSubject: Re: Is snow nose real?   Sat Dec 07, 2013 11:06 pm

I'm pretty curious to know if there's more behind it as well since Link has a snow nose, and Yuki doesn't, as both get an equal amount of sunlight and drink/eat from the same stainless steel dishes. Link had his when he came to me though - but I'd imagine after a few months it'd either turn back solid or Yuki's would start to form if it was environmental.
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kelly.hynum
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PostSubject: Re: Is snow nose real?   Sat Dec 07, 2013 11:44 pm

Luna turned a year old in May and has just now gotten "snow nose" since the weather has started turning colder. She has never eaten or drunk out of plastic bowls, they have always been stainless steel or glass. And as far as I know, neither of her parents have it. I will ask the breeder if any of his dogs have it though. And when I say "Does snow nose really exist", I mean does it really exist, is it really something that happens because of outside elements or is her pink in the middle nose an inherited trait, just like she inherited blue eyes and black and white fur.
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Mobezilla
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PostSubject: Re: Is snow nose real?   Sat Dec 07, 2013 11:46 pm

Whether its from an outside element, or an inherited trait, it is still called 'Snow nose' and it really does exist. Just like regular coat/wooly coat, solid nose/snow nose. Regardless how it happened, thats the title of it.
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seattlesibe
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PostSubject: Re: Is snow nose real?   Sun Dec 08, 2013 1:08 am

Yeah, it is a real thing whether or not it was nature or nurture, as it were. It is a real physiological phenomenon, and one that is accepted as perfectly normal in the breed from both a health perspective and also in the show ring from a conformation perspective.

There seems to be some speculation that it is a different thing all together in the breed than it is when it occurs in other breeds, but I can't yet find anything definitive.

As an analogy though, consider that bi-eyes in the breed is not technically heterochromia (an abnormal condition resulting in two different color eyes--of course implying that two eyes of the same color is genetically normal).

So when a human has two different color eyes, that's heterochromia. When a Husky has two different color eyes, it's not abnormal because the eye color of each eye is determined independently from one another. Hence, bi-eyed.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but that's the case I am almost 100% certain.

Long story short, this breed has some fishy stuff going on with color pigmentation in their geneotypes and phenotypes. I would love to know the history and evolutionary function of this. I repeat, we need an IAHT research grant! Who is trained in grant writing around here?

I love em for it though Smile
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Niraya
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PostSubject: Re: Is snow nose real?   Sun Dec 08, 2013 8:16 am

I believe snow nosewas coined because people noticed it occurring when it started getting cool/snowing but it went away when it started to get warm.

It is also only what I've seen mentioned or heard about with the plastic dishes. It doesn't mean that is the only thing that could cause it -.-

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Niraya
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PostSubject: Re: Is snow nose real?   Sun Dec 08, 2013 8:26 am

Some genetics stuff.

"The term "snow nose" or "winter nose" is used for the seasonal change in nose pigmentation that occurs in some dogs. The middle of the nose looses color and becomes pinkish, as shown on the Saluki at the left at the end of winter. The outer edges usually remain the original color. The color does return to this Saluki, as shown on the right, in summer. Some owners have observed that over the years the color does not totally come back during the summer months as the dog ages.

The biochemical cause of this phenomenon is not understood. No gene causing this seasonal change in nose color has been reported. It is not even clear if this runs in families or not.

Note that the paw pad pigmentation is not lost, as the same Saluki demonstrates on the far right."

http://homepage.usask.ca/~schmutz/dogNose.html

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wpskier222
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PostSubject: Re: Is snow nose real?   Sun Dec 08, 2013 12:47 pm

That's interesting. I always thought it was genetic! I guess I was off on that one. Smile I do wonder what causes it though. Tasha did not have it and neither does Dizzy. Even during her later years when she spent a lot of time laying on a snow bank (her choice, she just loved being outside) watching the world go by, she never developed it. Their lifestyles couldn't be more different since Dizzy is totally a city dog. It would be interesting to know the actual cause. In terms of bowls honestly that sounds a bit silly to me, more like a correlation not a causation. Maybe those that switched happened to switch at the beginning of summer and it magically went away. Tasha had plastic and Dizzy has metal.

Ceara - looks like we finally found something we disagree on. Wink I love the snow nose! It's cute on some and cool looking on others. Was kinda hoping it might show up on Diz but looks like I'm outta luck on that one, among other things. Btw, Link's sire is a snobear dog. Kylie's brother. Smile
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