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 Resistant Giardia in 6 month old

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mellosmandu
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PostSubject: Resistant Giardia in 6 month old   Wed Aug 01, 2018 11:53 pm

We had gotten our husky at 8 weeks, and pretty much since then, he's had a resistant case of Giardia. It was quite apparent because right when we brought him home, his diarrhea was pretty much pure liquid (mind you my 3 other dogs never had this as puppies). We went to the vet the next day and found out from his fecal that he had Giardia, so we treated it the first time with Panacur and a probiotic to aid with digestion (and we treated the other 3 just in case). We cleaned everything, even wiping his feet and bum every time he went #2, as well as thorough baths weekly.

Flash forward he's now 6 month's old and still has Giardia. He was treated 2 more times after his initial diagnosis, the second treatment being Panacur and Metronizadole, and the third treatment being Panacur and Clavamox. The vet is recommending the fourth treatment of Panacur and a higher dosage of Metronizadole, but the side effects being seizures. Does anyone have any experience with Giardia? We are thinking about getting a second opinion from another vet to make sure we're not being duped here (our current one is quite money hungry) as well as waiting till he's older to treat him, as I feel like all of these meds on a puppy is quite harsh.
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TwisterII
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PostSubject: Re: Resistant Giardia in 6 month old   Thu Aug 02, 2018 9:53 am

When I got my second he was infested with both giardia and hookworms. A round of Praziquantal and Metronizadole cleared him up and this was a dog that had had them for a long time and had a very compromised immune system. I would think worth a second opinion. Make sure that what they are seeing in the fecals really is what is there. It is hard to get rid of. A lot of work. Once they have had them the reinfect themselves very easily. My routine with him was to get lysol wipes and wipe the whole house down. Everywhere he walked, bleach his bowls, wash his toys. When he went out to do anything, pee or poop, I had a spray bottle of slightly diluted bleach and I would bleach the spot. Any feces remove from the yard and throw away where no animal can touch it and bleach the spot where it sat. Yes, I had dead spots in my yard, but if any dogs even sniffs the spot where it was it could be passed or reinfected. When he came in I used the lysol wipes to wipe down his feet and bum.

All the medication is hard on the digestive system. Having the second opinion nail down that it is still giardia and not just a case of collitis from all the meds could be beneficial. Giardia stinks. His poops will likely smell like death. As the smell cleared that's how I could tell he was getting better. I didn't get solid poops until he was off the meds for a bit and his digestive tract had a chance to heal.

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LannA89
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PostSubject: Re: Resistant Giardia in 6 month old   Thu Aug 02, 2018 10:28 am

@mellosmandu: Hello and so sorry to hear about your sweet baby. It is always unfortunate when our baby's are sick and especially when it can not be resolved. Our girl had it when we brought her home as well. It was about a week 1/2 after having her with us she suddenly became so ill. For us they also did the Panacur with the Metronizadole, we did fluid therapy as well as, a 30 day probiotic gel. We were told to treat her for six days with antibiotics and then 10 days after, do another round of the antibiotics since the parasite has cycles. Another medication that can be tried is Albendazole, maybe ask the vet about that and see what they say. From what I know you should be able to buy Panacur over the counter if you are interested. I would suggest getting another opinion since this is your pups fourth bout of this, I can only imagine the suffering your baby is going through.

I know you may already know this as well, but it is always good to check your dogs surroundings. Is there anything in his immediate surroundings he could be getting into that is keeping it in his system. Keep a poop bucket to keep the yard clean of all infected feces and as you said you are already doing, keeping him clean as well as the home. Constant cleaning of all food and water bowls as well.

I hope that you and the vet are able to get this figured out so your pup can get to feeling better and normal. Best of luck to you. <3
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mellosmandu
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PostSubject: Re: Resistant Giardia in 6 month old   Thu Aug 02, 2018 4:23 pm

@TwisterII Yeah Giardia is really kicking our butts, unfortunately we can't bleach our yard (given we also live on 3 acres) but we do pick up his poop immediately after he goes. Did your pup have random waves of diarrhea with it? He'll have diarrhea for maybe a week, and then will go another week with total solid poops. A family friend is a retired veterinarian and he mentioned that you should only treat it with the symptoms. We definitely want a second opinion, we're just tight on cash as we just neutered him (about $450 for his procedure alone!!!). I just feel terrible giving him all these meds, as he's pretty much has not been on meds since we've gotten him..

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mellosmandu
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PostSubject: Re: Resistant Giardia in 6 month old   Thu Aug 02, 2018 4:27 pm

@LannA89 Thank you for the suggestions! Unfortunately some things do slip past us as we live on a larger property, but for the most part we're pretty good about the yard and keeping it clean (especially since we have other dogs who thankfully have tested negative for Giardia).
Yeah the last 2 times we had to treat with Panacur, we bought it through Chewy as it's about $40 cheaper through Chewy than our vet... I just feel hesitant giving it to him so much because I feel like it's wiping even the good bacteria in his gut. It definitely is tough having a sick baby..
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TwisterII
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PostSubject: Re: Resistant Giardia in 6 month old   Thu Aug 02, 2018 5:02 pm

You may need to limit how much of the yard he can use until you can better contain this. They can reinfect themselves in something as simple as a little standing water, either in a puddle or bucket, lid that has caught water at some point. I have an acre mine run and I followed him around all of it with my bleach spritzer. He got no alone time in the yard until he was clear. We didn't have moments where he would suddenly get better. His poops were pretty much liquid until it started to clear up. Once the entire round of medication was done then he slowly started to firm up over a week or so after. Having rounds of solid poops for a bit and then going back to not solid poops for a bit makes me wonder if that's not when he's being reinfected verses never actually getting over Giardia at all. Or if he no longer has Giardia but instead is just dealing with something else or some kind of digestion upset from all the medication. How long are you going between rounds of medication? Has there been any down time between medications or has it just been back to back to back. About how much down time has there been between medications or rounds of meds?

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mellosmandu
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PostSubject: Re: Resistant Giardia in 6 month old   Thu Aug 02, 2018 5:15 pm

@TwisterII Hmmm... yeah, usually when he is out, someone is out there with him or is watching him. I don't believe he's reinfecting himself just because of how our other dogs are always coming up negative in their fecal tests.

He usually went a week untreated before being medicated again, right now is the longest he's gone in between being medicated (2 months), as the new dosage left me hesitant (seizures being a main symptom) as well as the price. My partner and I are working college students, so we try our best to keep up with his vet bills (we've spent about $600 in medications for our little one in meds alone).
His poops would be fine as he's being treated, but literally the next day of being without meds, he'd have diarrhea for a week and then bounce back.
The vet did mention his immune system could just not be strong enough to kick this even with the meds. Therefore, i was wondering if i should just wait to do the higher dosage till he's older, when i'm hoping his immune system will be stronger, or if i should just go and see the 2nd vet and see what happens there or both LOL.
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PostSubject: Re: Resistant Giardia in 6 month old   Thu Aug 02, 2018 9:14 pm

My pup had Guardia. I live in Uk so our vets may treat different. Basically he was riddled  with worms they were almost a foot long.  I was told he was wormed when I got him. I took him to my vets he said he had not been worked at all due to size of worms, he gave me a working tablet and for days after he passed huge dead ones so it was not just one or two. After this he had liquid stools I put it down to change in food , working tablet and settling in. The liquid stools did not clear up. I took him to vet who diagnosed Guardia. This is the first time I've come across it and had dogs all my life. I was given three things to clear it up increases paste which was chicken flavoured and helps harden stools. After a week or so he was better. The vet told me  it was a parasite all dogs can get it just puppies are affected due to weak immune systems so they can't fight it off. One thing I did do as Gardia is transmitted through poop is put a bucket of disinfectant over where my pup did a stool Hope any of that helps..
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PostSubject: Re: Resistant Giardia in 6 month old   Fri Aug 03, 2018 10:12 am

Pure canned pumpkin should help firm up stools. I would mix the pumpkin with plain Greek yogurt and give that for a bit and see what happens. Assess the food you feed as well. A good quality food should help with immune issues. Nutrition makes a huge difference. It might not be Giardia at this point. It could be something else and they are just assuming Giardia because he's had it before and it can be hard to spot sometimes.

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mellosmandu
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PostSubject: Re: Resistant Giardia in 6 month old   Fri Aug 03, 2018 9:50 pm

@Lycan1 thank you for the suggestions Smile unfortunately, I can't spray any disinfectants in my yard, as I have other animals and don't really want to kill my grass Sad I was the same way! I've owned about 10 dogs before this pup and never have they tested for Giardia..

We were also told he was wormed and was "giardia-free" upon getting him but after a few days and vet visit that was totally disproved scratch I just think it was laziness on the breeder's part, as it would of been fine had we only had him, but we have 3 other dogs, so that's 3x the meds and money!


Last edited by mellosmandu on Fri Aug 03, 2018 10:00 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostSubject: Re: Resistant Giardia in 6 month old   Fri Aug 03, 2018 9:55 pm

@TwisterII He's been on a probiotic pretty much since he's been diagnosed with Giardia. It's the Herbsmith's Microflora Plus. He used to be on Orijen Puppy, but I think it was becoming too rich for his gut, so we have switched him to Holistic Grain Free Puppy (this was chosen as their food contains good prebiotics and probiotics and is easy on sensitive tummies). We are debating on whether or not to put him on a raw diet since I have read that it's helpful for dogs with sensitive tummies.

Before though when he was having his severe bouts of Diarrhea, I was adding cooked ground turkey (cooked with a little bit of water, no oils or seasonings) with white rice, butternut squash with some carrots and green beans to his kibble, which seemed to help solidify his poops. Although we don't feed this every day, as it does get to be on the pricier side with how much he eats :/
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PostSubject: Re: Resistant Giardia in 6 month old   Sat Aug 04, 2018 2:14 pm

Raw can be a great option. Since he is a puppy you will need to insure that you really do your homework and make sure you balance properly. If you decide to go the raw route we can help if you wish. There's a few of us, myself included, who feed full or partially raw. I personally would start with a second opinion and go from there.

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LannA89
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PostSubject: Re: Resistant Giardia in 6 month old   Tue Aug 07, 2018 10:06 am

@mellosmandu. I can understand the larger property issue as we have 3+ acres too and I would say maybe keep him a little more contained to a certain portion of the yard until he can get rid of this. I agree the panacur may be wiping out the good stuff as well.Maybe he needs a different probiotic since I saw you said he has been on one since his diagnosis. I too, recommend plain yogurt and canned pumpkin for your pup. Also a more bland diet than maybe bagged dog food. There are many people on here that can offer great insight to getting into raw diets as well. Very Happy ^

Did you go to a second vet for another opinion of his health? If so what did they say?
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PostSubject: Re: Resistant Giardia in 6 month old   Wed Aug 22, 2018 6:30 pm

@LannA89 Sorry for the long delay, the fall semester started for me and it's been hectic to say the least. We haven't seen another vet due to our budget and conflicting schedules, but once we get it rolling by seeing the vet and getting a second opinion, i will definitely give an update!

My partner and myself have decided to put our pup on the raw diet, just trying to figure it all out (I have posted another topic about the raw food). Probably by the end of next week, he should be on it! He does get the occasional pure goat milk yogurt, and i completely forgot he used to be on Fortiflora by Purina, but we quickly switched out of that. I'm not a fan of the company, and I didn't like that it wasn't weighted out but rather it was all up to the owner to figure out how much to give! He's been on the Herbsmith's Microflora for only about 3 months so far. It's really great, and even smells good (like cinnamon).
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