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loona
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PostSubject: Re: feeding amount    Tue Aug 30, 2011 12:29 am

so , the food im feeding her is pedigree food for juniors ... and again i dont know exactly her weight but its about ... 8 kilos i would say , shes three months old

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PostSubject: Re: feeding amount    Tue Aug 30, 2011 9:29 am

So you are feeding a fairly low quality puppy food, which means yes, you would need more of it to make sure your puppy gets the proper nutrition. Dogs need meat. It should be the first and main ingredient in any food. Your dog food's first ingredients are a bunch of grains. Meat byproducts (which is the lowest quality meat because it's not a named source) are the second ingredients. That's just to explain what I mean about poor quality. I would try to find a food that has meat as the first ingredient, at the very least.

The feeding instructions are awful on the bag and vague. It says puppies 1-3 months should get 145g, then it says puppies 3-6 should get 260. That's a huge jump and doesn't properly indicate when you should make the switch. If we go by SabakaMom's measurements, 1/2 cup 3x a day is what you are feeding, meaning 1.5 cups of food a day. With the food you are feeding, she needs twice this much. Since Loona is 3 months old, I would switch her to 260g of food for now (until you decide to switch if you do).

I think the diarrhea is from her food. I have a feeling the low quality food is affecting her digestion. Many huskies do not do well on grain inclusive foods and your food has grain as the first ingredient. If she still has diarrhea, I would try feeding her some scrambled eggs and boiled BONELESS chicken. See if this helps clear up her diarrhea. If so, DEFINITELY switch foods and try searching for a grain free variety.

There are lots of people on this board that can help you. Even though you are in Europe, we do know of some good quality foods that are available there. However, the food is going to be a bit more expensive than you are feeding now. On the other hand, you will need to feed less of it, so the price does even out because each bag will last longer.

Good luck!


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PostSubject: Re: feeding amount    Tue Aug 30, 2011 1:04 pm

I would definitely switch her food right away. Pedigree has bone and meat meal.. which means there's a probability you are feeding your dog euthanized animals, aka other dogs.
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PostSubject: Re: feeding amount    Tue Aug 30, 2011 1:38 pm

Heatherlee wrote:
Pedigree has bone and meat meal.. which means there's a probability you are feeding your dog euthanized animals, aka other dogs.

The bone meal is from livestock and farm animals that were slaughtered or died of natural causes, not euthanize dogs. lol
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PostSubject: Re: feeding amount    Tue Aug 30, 2011 1:44 pm

There is a possibility, there was research done on it and proof found that bone and meat meal can come from shelters and be from the euthanized animals. I didn't say all bone and meat meal was, I said there is the possibility.. they don't identify their source for each batch so it isn't like you can 100% claim what is in it.
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PostSubject: Re: feeding amount    Tue Aug 30, 2011 1:54 pm

@hypers987 wrote:
The bone meal is from livestock and farm animals that were slaughtered or died of natural causes, not euthanize dogs. lol

We actually don't know what or where the bone meal comes from because it isn't listed or disclosed. Wink

And what about the 4 D's? (Dead, Dying, Diseased & Disabled)

Heatherlee wrote:
There is a possibility, there was research done on it and proof found that bone and meat meal can come from shelters and be from the euthanized animals. I didn't say all bone and meat meal was, I said there is the possibility.. they don't identify their source for each batch so it isn't like you can 100% claim what is in it.

Heather is correct, there is the possibility that euthanized animals are in low grade commercial pet food but again you won't know for sure since the labeling doesn't tell you. I know I've seen publications in years past that have proved that traces of the euthanasia drug used to put animals to sleep has been detected in low grade pet foods that have been independently tested. It was a real shocker for me to learn about and since then I've decided that any and all pets of mine are going to be buried by me personally or cremated because I do not want my pets' to end up in a cheap pet food after they've passed. The idea is just sickening to me.

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PostSubject: Re: feeding amount    Tue Aug 30, 2011 2:02 pm

I figured you'd chime in and elaborate. Very Happy You are always good at remember specifics, which I am not in these cases. It really is sickening. Pedigree is one of those foods that whenever I see someone buying a bag I want to vomit.
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SabakaMom
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PostSubject: Re: feeding amount    Tue Aug 30, 2011 2:51 pm

I would encourage you to make a dog food change as well. I looked briefly at the Pedigree online and noticed that, for a dog the size of mine, the manufacturer IS recommending twice the amount I feed. So I can truely say that if I bought the Pedigree it would last only half as long as what I feed.

I know going completely grain-free can be expensive, so if you cannot make that large of a jump in price, you can still get some better foods for not that much money. I have a rule that I like the first few ingredients to be meats, then I avoid corn and soy and wheat, I have no problem with rice or oats or millet (as long as your pup is not allergic to them). If you do your homework, you can find something that agrees with both your dog and your bank account!
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PostSubject: Re: feeding amount    Tue Aug 30, 2011 5:21 pm

Heatherlee wrote:
I figured you'd chime in and elaborate. Very Happy You are always good at remember specifics, which I am not in these cases. It really is sickening. Pedigree is one of those foods that whenever I see someone buying a bag I want to vomit.
I remember way back when, I saw a documentary on Purina and Pedigree that they used euthanized horses to make up the protein in their dog food. Grossed me out and I thought, 'I don't want my Buster ending up as dog food!!!!' (Buster is now in horsey heaven...)




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PostSubject: Re: feeding amount    Tue Aug 30, 2011 8:42 pm

The grains might be causing the diarrhea. I know Elara did until I put her on a grain free diet.

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loona
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PostSubject: Re: feeding amount    Wed Aug 31, 2011 7:56 am

at the first i bought her expensive and quality food , it was on discount , but that isnt important , one day we went out of food and then i bought this bag in my local shop with ordinery everyday stuff because i couldnt get in the pet shop ... ill buy her a better food

ok , so ... 80 grams x 3 per day ? that is ok ?

and i doubt that my dog is eating dogs because this brand of food is on commercials and its not THAT bad food , but ill no longer feed her with it ...

and as i opened theme here , ill switch to other if you mind but right now im going to college and buying a car and making a transition but my dog worries me , because she is so i would not say bad or mean or something like that , rather than hyperactive ... she barks at me and she stopped biting me , but she jumps around crazy and barks and sometimes it really gets to me , i walk her regullary but she learned somehow to pee inside , on the carpet , today she peed on my bed :/
I just need her to be a bit more calm and not to bite everything and going all nuts .
so basically questions

is it too late to teach her not to pee and go toilet inside ? and how would i succed that ?
and what would you recommend to give her as a toy to stop barking and go all crazy because i need something to keep her busy when i want to do something alone , she bites everything and than it gets bored by it ...
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PostSubject: Re: feeding amount    Wed Aug 31, 2011 7:58 am

and another quick question ... is it essential for me to teach my dog some things ? to train her ? and what should i start learning her ? thanks
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PostSubject: Re: feeding amount    Wed Aug 31, 2011 8:43 am

Commercials don't mean anything. I'm not saying there are euthanized dogs in the food, but I'm not saying there ISN'T just because the dog food is on commercials. Only the worst quality dog foods are on commercials over here. You need to read and do research for yourself and make the best informed decision for you and your dog and not listen to everything that the television provides for you. Just by reading the ingredients on the manufacturer's website, I would NEVER recommend that food and NEVER feed it to my dogs. But I know what I'm looking for and why.

You have a puppy on your hands. All she wants to do is eat, sleep and play. Walking her isn't enough and we've said this before. She needs to be CONSTANTLY stimulated. Training will wear her out, games of hide the queen with treats, fetch in the yard... all of these things ON TOP of regular walks NEED to happen or she is going to act just like she is. Your dog is normal. She is a husky and this is exactly what you should expect of one.

Honestly, and I know that you're not going to like this, she's peeing inside to get your attention. From what you describe, she's not getting enough exercise or attention. She shouldn't be peeing inside at this age because you should be taking her out often. Please read the Potty Training Thread (http://www.itsahuskything.com/t920-potty-training). You should be doing all those things. Get yourself a good enzyme cleaner to clean up where she has messed already. Also, she is three months old... she can only physically hold in her pee for 3 hours. If you don't take her out every 3 hours, that's your fault that she's peeing inside, not hers.

Lastly, we can't tell you what to do to train your dog. That is your decision as her owner. Do you want her to sit when you ask her to? Then train her. Do you want her to stay or not jump up on people? Then train her. If you don't care about these things, then don't train her. You need to take responsibility for her and what she does because everything she does wrong is your fault and responsibility and that is NOT meant to be mean. Everything that MY dogs do wrong are MY responsibility too. But you are getting frustrated at your dog for doing what instinct has told her to do because she doesn't know any better.

ETA: Google Nothing In Life Is Free training. It's very simple and easy. It's something you can do everyday without even thinking about it really. This should help a little with her behavior and boundaries, but you need to take the initiative and do it. It also won't fix everything.

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Last edited by Koda on Wed Aug 31, 2011 9:04 am; edited 1 time in total
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hypers987
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PostSubject: Re: feeding amount    Wed Aug 31, 2011 9:00 am

I agree with everything that Tori posted above. No dog has ever died or gotten sick from eating a grocery store brand food and most dog live full healthy lives on them. I live in the agricultural capitol of the entire country, my dad has been working in feed mills since before he met my mom. The FDA regulations that go into pet food is crazy and between OSHA and the FDA every source that they get there ingredients is monitored. This doesnt mean me or my dad would feed a grocery store brand to our dogs, i'm just saying it not a horror like they are being portrayed.

As for training, that's up to you. I trained Kale the basics, sit, stay, wait, leave it, and down. Since he's always loved learning new things and is so easy to train (unlike some huskys) i taught him spin, rollover, and shake. I also leash trained him to walk next to me on walks, and on loose lead when on trails.
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arooroomom
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PostSubject: Re: feeding amount    Wed Aug 31, 2011 9:21 am

Loona sounds like a normal, regular Siberian Husky puppy. This is what they're like. The want your attention and need to let out energy. And if you're not going to show them the right way to do that... this is what she's going to do. Puppies require a lot of time and patience.

As for the food, no. I wouldn't feed it. When I first got Mickey and then Cheyenne a few months later we were in a crappy situation money-wise. But I sucked it up and switched them to Wellness as soon as I began to understand what my dog was really eating. It's not all that expensive if you buy the largest size bag and shop smart. I'm a college student, have a gas sucking truck, as well as work and am training for another job. I know what it's like- but you chose to get a puppy and you need to fulfill the puppies needs/requirements.

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PostSubject: Re: feeding amount    Wed Aug 31, 2011 12:43 pm

I know if she does something its my fault , i know that all . but sometimes we go outside , we run , we play , and inside we play also , but what gets me frustrated is when she stands in front of me when im sitting and doing something and she started barking , i know shes not ungry , not thirsty , we just got from outside , she went on toilet and all , and i dont know what to do , well i maybe know , she wants to play ! i get it all but i dont know which toys to play . and you didnt to answer my questions , when i asked which toys i could buy for her to keep her fun and busy ... i take fully responsibility but i just want some advices for what to do when she acts like she acts , because i dont know what to do when shes barking at me loudly and she looks mean and dont listen to me . i teached her already to follow me , i mean , shes always following me , i teached to let go of something when outside she bites everything , and i just want to teach her to not jump on me outside when shes hyper and not to bark all the time ! thanks for help btw !
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PostSubject: Re: feeding amount    Wed Aug 31, 2011 12:58 pm

I think sometimes that you don't get the responses that you want and therefore you think we don't answer them. When you posted about toys to keep her busy, everyone responded with nothing really keeps our dogs busy. LOL. There is no "magic toy"... you just have to buy what your dog likes and replace it when it gets destroyed. Further, every dog is different. What Sometimes what Heather's Koda loves, mine turn their noses up at and vice versa. Smile

Owning a dog is a lot more trial and error than a lot of people think. There is no magic fix, no one-size-fits-all training method. It's about individual dogs.

I think you should invest in a crate. If you are truly wearing your Loona out when you play outside and you're getting bombarded when you come inside, then you need a "quiet time" space for her. A crate is a GREAT way to do that and will help with all of your other issues as well (like potty training).

Your frustrations are normal, but so is her behavior. So you need to find a way to deal with your frustrations because they aren't just going to go away. Koda and Hailey STILL bother the crap out of me sometimes. Hailey has this new thing where she wants to go outside every hour it seems just to chase the squirrels. I have to shut her out of my office in order to get her to stop whining. You'd think I was abusing her! These dogs are intelligent and manipulative. You need to learn how to be in charge so that she responds to you. Nothing in Life Is Free will help with that.

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SabakaMom
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PostSubject: Re: feeding amount    Wed Aug 31, 2011 10:35 pm

I believe you have had Loona for a little while now. We did not even get Sabaka until he was nearly 3 months old. I think he was around 10 - 1/2 weeks. We still had weeks and weeks and WEEKS more of potty training. I was home almost all day taking him out regularly and when I was not at home he was in a crate. He still had many accidents. I think I could have prevented some of those accidents by putting up some baby gates to stop him from going into certain rooms. For example, we rarely use our dining room. It is a room with no doors. Sabaka found that he could sneak into the dining room and pee and it would be a while before I noticed. I finally blocked off the dining room. He would never pee with me watching.

Remember he really is still just a baby! He is expected to learn all these new manners and behaviors... You must try to be patient. BUT I will also say that I think Loona is beginning to think she is the boss of you. If she knows that she can bark and jump and get playtime then she WILL jump and bark and get playtime from you! You must show her that you will only play when she has good manners. My dog submitted quickly to 3 of the 4 people in the house but he decided that he was alpha over one of my sons. After a few weeks of consistent training, his behavior has improved with that child.

About toys... Everyone has favorites. We use an inexpensive tug rope toy for most of our interactive play or we toss balls. Some people do not believe that tugging with a dog is an appropriate activity (you have to make your own decision on that). Some huskies (maybe most huskies) do not like the game of fetching a ball (you will have to find out if that is something Loona enjoys). Not all dogs like the same things.

Husky puppies take LOTS of time and energy and patience...! Good luck!
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PostSubject: Re: feeding amount    Wed Aug 31, 2011 10:51 pm

There is definitely no magic fix! Mya is 5 years old and STILL comes up to me and starts crying and barking at me for attention after they already went on their walk, ate, and went potty. I have to ignore her or lock her out and she gets the point. Kody does exactly what loona does (he just turned 1yr old) and when I know that I've exercised him as much as I possibly can, played with him, he's eaten, and has water then he goes on TIMEOUT in the bathroom. I leave him locked in there for 5min and let him out. If he starts barking at me again I put him back in for another 5min. I do this until he gives up and lays down. It takes a while. They are very stubborn!

As for the toys...like everybody else has said...it's different with every dog. What works with mine is the kong. I believe I posted a link in a previous thread, but here it is again:

http://www.petsmart.com/product/index.jsp?productId=3206970&lmdn=Dog+Toys

this also works:

http://www.petsmart.com/family/index.jsp?categoryId=2767084&f=Taxonomy%2FPET%2F2767084&lmdn=Brand&f=PAD%2FBrands%2FKong+Wubba&fbc=1&fbn=Brands|Kong+Wubba&fbx=0

If you can't find these maybe you can order them online?
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PostSubject: Re: feeding amount    Thu Sep 01, 2011 8:00 am

first of all i would like to say you all have beautifull dogs , from what i can see on your little pictures , and yours , koda , the white husky is so nice and handsome Smile

ive read the nilf method training and it says if i understood , that if dog barks and wants attention , coming from him first you must ignore that , so its difficult sometimes to ignore her and stay calm when she sneaks behind me when im laying and barks at my ear , its so loud ! and than i ignore her . she is getting a bit better , when shes barking alot i hold her for the back of the neck , and put her in the bathroom , the small one where she dont like to be . and today , i got her outside about 7 am and she did go to toilet , but when we got home , she did it again , for couple of minutes ... so thats somehow strange uh ?
and i need to clean my matress somehow because she peed there , and today she peed again , she never did that before , but i guess she scented some old pee trace from human ( i dont know when that happend ... Very Happy )
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PostSubject: Re: feeding amount    Thu Sep 01, 2011 10:40 am

Thank you Smile

What makes you think this will be easy? Razz Ignoring the dogs when they are like that is hard, but that's why it works. Here's a tip that I used with Koda, who was persistent and ANNOYING. If I knew that I had walked him, exhausted him, and he just wanted to play and I needed people time, I'd walk away from him and shut myself in a room for a few minutes. I'd sit down and listen for him. He'd pay at the door for a minute, howl, walk around and then eventually he'd calm down or lie down. When he got calm, I'd come out. He might start up again right away, but after doing that just a couple of times each instance, he'd stop. He eventually understood that he's only allowed to act like that when he needs something (like go to the bathroom).

And you need to get an enzyme cleaner for your mattress and steam clean it. I will say that if you don't act responsible, how do you expect your dog to?

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PostSubject: Re: feeding amount    Thu Sep 01, 2011 10:48 am

You may want her checked out just to be sure she doesn't have a UTI. Cheyenne had one when we first brought her home and I felt like I was going in circles with housebreaking! If you don't have a crate, i'd highly suggest one. Helps a lot with potty training as well as giving her a place to have her own space.

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PostSubject: Re: feeding amount    Thu Sep 01, 2011 11:23 am

@loona wrote:
and i need to clean my matress somehow because she peed there , and today she peed again , she never did that before , but i guess she scented some old pee trace from human ( i dont know when that happend ... Very Happy )

Just a note, she didn't pee on your bed because a human did at some point. She just decided to pee on your bed, for whatever reason, and then peed again because she smelt her own scent on it. Like suggested, you need to get an enzyme cleaner to get the stain and odor out so she won't go there again (you can get one at any pet store).
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PostSubject: Re: feeding amount    Thu Sep 01, 2011 4:37 pm

Heatherlee wrote:
Just a note, she didn't pee on your bed because a human did at some point. She just decided to pee on your bed, for whatever reason, and then peed again because she smelt her own scent on it. Like suggested, you need to get an enzyme cleaner to get the stain and odor out so she won't go there again (you can get one at any pet store).

Yup! and that goes for every place that she has eliminated, if the cleaner you used didn't remove the smell, she will more than likely use that same place again. Surprisingly enough my cats are worse than my dogs... Neutral
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PostSubject: Re: feeding amount    Thu Sep 01, 2011 4:44 pm

@hypers987 wrote:
Heatherlee wrote:
Just a note, she didn't pee on your bed because a human did at some point. She just decided to pee on your bed, for whatever reason, and then peed again because she smelt her own scent on it. Like suggested, you need to get an enzyme cleaner to get the stain and odor out so she won't go there again (you can get one at any pet store).
Surprisingly enough my cats are worse than my dogs... Neutral
That's not surprising at all actually Laughing

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