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 I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me.

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ksheen
Newborn
Newborn
ksheen

Female Join date : 2013-06-25

I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me. Empty
PostSubject: I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me.   I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me. EmptySat Jun 29, 2013 2:51 pm

Hi Everyone!
So I have a 13 week old siberian husky, and he has the hardest time with me leaving him alone. I need to have him in the crate because he isn't completely potty trained and still chews on things. I have tried having him in there so he can see me, there is a towel over the crate, it isn't too big, there is a fan pointed at it, no interest in a ticking clock or hot water bottle wrapped in my shirt, I put a kong in there when I leave (frozen too so it keeps him occupied longer) and he plays with it then the second it's gone he starts screaming and crying and howling. I have done all the steps to crating and he just hates it. Even when I walk down stairs and he is on the other side of the baby gate he starts whining because he can't see me. I am moving with him into an apartment in august and I have to go to school and I don't think the other people in my complex would appreciate the screaming. He wont be alone that long because my boyfriend lives a block away and will come play with him and let him out but I don't know what to do anymore. I can't have him screaming all the time and I also can't have him destroying everything. Any advice would help or if anyone lives in colorado as well and might know a good trainer I am willing to try anything.
Thank you so much Please help I am desperate.
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siku&nikolai
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siku&nikolai

Female Join date : 2013-06-17
Location : Maine

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PostSubject: Re: I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me.   I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me. EmptySat Jun 29, 2013 3:08 pm

What do you do when he is screaming? Do you let him out of his crate immediately?
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AngelCocoaPup
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Newborn
AngelCocoaPup

Join date : 2013-06-20

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PostSubject: Re: I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me.   I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me. EmptySat Jun 29, 2013 3:52 pm

The best general advice I can give you is to work on crate training Balto when he's already burned off energy.  Work on him getting used to the crate in the tiniest steps.  For example, start with the crate door open, then close it for a split second, then a little longer.  Work up to leaving the room, then the house.  It will take time.  A trainer would be be able to help you in ways that are specific to your situation and your puppy.

I once had a person with a husky living in my apartment complex.  There were a couple of times when I could hear her whining her displeasure, but I didn't mind as much because I grew up with huskies.  I guess you won't be so lucky with your neighbors.

Good luck.  You've got  a cute one there. Smile
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techigirl78
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techigirl78

Female Join date : 2013-06-26
Location : Wisconsin

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PostSubject: Re: I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me.   I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me. EmptySat Jun 29, 2013 5:47 pm

Only had mine a week but I agree on the energy thing. He cares less when he is passing out. I leave my little guy with other dogs though that he can see. Do you fill kong?

Also maybe ignore him for minute at bottom of stairs and hide in silence. Mine will do that but only last few seconds. When he sits and stops . . . I appear. Seems to be helping mine and it is clicking the screaming does not mean I come back. Good luck!
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ksheen
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Newborn
ksheen

Female Join date : 2013-06-25

I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me. Empty
PostSubject: Re: I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me.   I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me. EmptySat Jun 29, 2013 7:46 pm

When he screams I wait until he stops to come back into the room then a little more and make him lay down before he gets to come out. The kong is filled with frozen peanut butter. And I have tried the little steps but when I feel like I can move on its like two steps forward three steps back. Thanks for the adice though I can keep trying small steps but he is having a really hard time. Sad
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Bella_Jasper
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Bella_Jasper

Female Join date : 2013-02-08
Location : Bolingbrook, IL

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PostSubject: Re: I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me.   I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me. EmptySat Jun 29, 2013 8:09 pm

Maybe try leaving a radio or tv on for him? This used to help our old dogs. I noticed with my current two that they cant be covered at all even partially maybe try not covering him too
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cinnamonbits
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Adult
cinnamonbits

Female Join date : 2012-11-03
Location : San Antonio, TX

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PostSubject: Re: I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me.   I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me. EmptySat Jun 29, 2013 8:10 pm

Do you have a shirt or something in the crate that smells like you? Do you feed meals in the crate? That was the best thing that worked for us, we fed Karli her every meal in there for about the first month. It helped a lot.
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KibaHope
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Teenager
KibaHope

Female Join date : 2012-11-05

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PostSubject: Re: I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me.   I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me. EmptySat Jun 29, 2013 11:07 pm

Wow it's like I wrote this. Kiba used to be insanely loud screaming in her crate and freaking out when I left the room even though she could see me through the baby gate . She also had little to no interest in toys I put in her crate. Honestly it took time. It was about two weeks of crate training before she quieted down a bit and only screamed for fifteen minutes or so each time (instead of hours). and then a few more weeks before she really only barked if she had to go to the bathroom or if she was bored. It was hard but believe me, There is an end to it.

First never let puppy out while its screaming. Feed him inside the crate. Make sure the crates not in an isolated room you never use. Don't make a big deal of putting him in and out. Just quietly put him in and let him out that helps it seem like its not a big deal. Give toys in the crate when your gone but I would take them out at night so he sleeps instead of playing. This is basically what we did- nothin fancy.  She does still bark to be let out in the morning when she wakes up but we can put her in there when at work without any fuss and she's fine. Good luck to you
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KibaHope
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Teenager
KibaHope

Female Join date : 2012-11-05

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PostSubject: Re: I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me.   I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me. EmptySat Jun 29, 2013 11:11 pm

Oh and it was so horrible I had to leave a note for our post-lady telling her about the puppy so she knew we weren't torturing a chimpanzee in my home when she heard kiba lol. I promise it just takes time for some huskies
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ksheen
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Newborn
ksheen

Female Join date : 2013-06-25

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PostSubject: Re: I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me.   I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me. EmptySun Jun 30, 2013 9:27 am

Okay I will try waiting it out. I have a TV on usually and he does AMAZING at night and only makes noise when he needs to go out and goes right to sleep. Now time to work one me leaving! I can try not covering it too but he cried before I covered it too and sometimeshe just ignores his toys. Do any of you have any advice on how to crate train him like what is the most effective way? He does great when I'm in the room but when I leave it gets loud. So any suggestions on how to maybe help him not be so stressed out while I'm training him or a method on training?
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ksheen
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Newborn
ksheen

Female Join date : 2013-06-25

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PostSubject: Re: I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me.   I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me. EmptySun Jun 30, 2013 11:07 am

And yes he gets his meals in the crate and then when he is done, sometimes he patiently waits for my boyfriend or I to let him out and sometimes he screams bloody murder. I am trying today just having him lay in there while I sit next to him watching tv and doing other things. I walked out of the room to grab my phone and he screamed the second he lost sight of me. I waited till he stopped and came back in, and now I am sitting next to him as he cries. He is tired and I know he is going to fall asleep soon so I may just wait for that. I know one thing he is not getting out while he is making a fuss.
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lillith87
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Senior
lillith87

Female Join date : 2013-05-26
Location : Michigan

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PostSubject: Re: I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me.   I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me. EmptySun Jun 30, 2013 11:20 am

Okay I have a really long thing for you, but I hope it works for you or someone else that passes by this.

I have been clicker training Okami since the day I got her. If you are unsure what clicker training is, it is a little thing you hold in your hand that you push a button and it makes a clicky sound. I got mine for 5 bucks at PetCo.

Anyways, if you don't know how to start using one, do some research, but I will tell you how I started.

You want to first start by one click. Then give Balto a treat. Then wait around 30 seconds or when Balto starts to get disinterested, the second you seem him start to loose attention, click+reward. Do this a few times, and then start doing it while he is still interested. This signs a contract with your dog, that you now have an agreement, that every time that clicker clicks he is going to get a treat, no if's and's or but's.

Now do simple commands like sit, lay down ect. It is extremely important that you click the very second the behavior you want to see is accomplished, so then he knows that is what he is getting a treat for.

So once you establish to Balto, that when he does things you ask, he gets a treat, move onto more difficult things like crate training.

Here is my crate training+Clicker tactic. (NOTE: Some of the portions of this method may not or will not happen over the course of one sitting. It could, but it is unlikely. This should take up to the course of a few days.)

Everything you have heard from everyone else is still true. Feed him in the crate, sleep in the crate, toys in the crate, kong, a shirt that smells like you.... You want the crate to be a safe haven, with things that make him feel like it is a wonderful place to go. Personally as far as the feeding inside the crate goes, I like to put the food just outside the crate because I can teach my "Don't take it until I say okay" Or my "Stay in your room" Command a lot easier, but both are fine.

So start by sitting in the room with him with the crate door open, also to where he can run around and play. Everytime he looks at the crate, sniffs ect Click+reward and even throw in some Praise+Love+Petting. And just let him go about to his business until he does it again. Click+reward ... do this for a while until you notice he realizes it is a "game"
Then stop click rewarding. This will confuse Balto a little. So

So now you wait until he tries to go into the crate. Two front feet in, jumping in then jump out, whatever it may be, if he touches the crate in anyway, click reward. Eventually this should turn into another "game"

Then you want to start added the command ,"Go to your crate." Or more to your own liking you can say whatever you want for the command, I personally use ,"To your room."

This may fall onto deaf ears but every time he goes to his room, obviously click and reward.
Do this until it would seem that he understands that is what you want of him.

Now for this next part, you can try to get him to go into the crate by command which is strongly encouraged at this point, but you may have to put him in there yourself. You want to start getting the door closed. So close it and do this in 10 second to 30, 40, minute, 3 minute and so on, sessions. Each time there is no whining, barking ect, open the door let him out and click reward. Just increase how long each time, until he realizes quiet, good or playing with toys, behavior is rewarded and noted.

Now you want to do this same step as before but go out of sight each time in longer each time sessions. Don't show your face until he stops crying or barking, this could take some time, but it will be worth it in the end. You cannot let him know that crying or barking will get his way.
Overtime, you should see an improvement of leaving the room. This will not happen the first time you try.

I hope this helps. Smile



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ksheen
Newborn
Newborn
ksheen

Female Join date : 2013-06-25

I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me. Empty
PostSubject: Re: I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me.   I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me. EmptySun Jun 30, 2013 11:25 am

Thank you so much. I guess I am going to have to just start over! He was doing so good, then a day off set him back! So I will start this right now, how long every day and how many times a day should i be doing this?
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lillith87
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lillith87

Female Join date : 2013-05-26
Location : Michigan

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PostSubject: Re: I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me.   I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me. EmptySun Jun 30, 2013 11:34 am

With puppies, you don't want to overwhelm them with clicker commands. Firstly because of stomach capacity, you don't want to stuff them up full of treats, they will never eat dinner or your will be cleaning the hard earned trick rewards off of the carpet. I would think that a max of 10 little tid bit treats do the trick in one session. (If he seems disinterested in the treats you are giving him, you want to step it up in the high valued treats, I like to use hot dogs. Just cut them up into thin slices.)

I would say no more then 15-20 minutes at a time. You need to let him process and learn what you are trying to do. It is safe to try doing these steps 2-3 times a day 5-6 hours apart.
You may want to go for a walk each time to wear him out, but teaching new tricks before meal time grabs their attention better. (It may screw with his will to eat though so be careful)
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ksheen
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ksheen

Female Join date : 2013-06-25

I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me. Empty
PostSubject: Re: I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me.   I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me. EmptySun Jun 30, 2013 11:54 am

We just got done with our first session (he was already part clicker trained) and he did wonderful! You were right that it turned into a game and now when I point and say go to your crate he goes! we are taking a break now. And about food, I make him sit and wait for me to put it in his crate until he gets to go get it. Another thing is am I doing right by shutting the door or should I start by leaving it open for a few feedings so he may leave when he is done eating? (By the way thank you so much you are helping me out so much!) Another question is when do you think he will have this mostly down? I am on an about two month time frame.
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lillith87
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lillith87

Female Join date : 2013-05-26
Location : Michigan

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PostSubject: Re: I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me.   I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me. EmptySun Jun 30, 2013 12:09 pm

I usually leave the door open for feeding, but as I said I leave it just outside the crate, and I have a you can't have it until I say "Okay" command (an entirely different non-clicker method training session) But I don't think there is a problem with it being opened or closed, I think it is just a preference thing.

I think that Okami was fully crate trained off of this method in little less then a week, but I am sure it will vary from dog to dog. It is much easier to train this method when they are still puppies so it should be fairly quick.
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ksheen
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ksheen

Female Join date : 2013-06-25

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PostSubject: Re: I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me.   I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me. EmptySun Jun 30, 2013 8:20 pm

When was your dog starting to ween off the treats with crating? Or does she still get one when she does good?
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lillith87
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lillith87

Female Join date : 2013-05-26
Location : Michigan

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PostSubject: Re: I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me.   I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me. EmptySun Jun 30, 2013 8:27 pm

When it became a second nature ( for her around 2-3 weeks) I stopped giving her treats for behavior, but rather just started giving treats in the crate just because, but not very often.
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ksheen
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ksheen

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PostSubject: Re: I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me.   I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me. EmptySun Jun 30, 2013 8:50 pm

Okay, We just got done with another session and he doesn't like even going in again. I am using your method but it looks like it is going to take him awhile before he gets this one down Sad a very frustrating thing that is for sure.
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husky_drea
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husky_drea

Female Join date : 2013-06-30
Location : SoCal

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PostSubject: Re: I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me.   I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me. EmptySun Jun 30, 2013 9:18 pm

Huskies are notoriously pack animals and you are their pack so they don't like to be separated from you, this is natural. I learned very quickly from my first husky over 18 years ago that they are much better dogs when crate trained, for safety, destruction and obedience. Every since then all of our huskies have been crate trained, some just do better than others, but with time they all came to accept their crate as their safe place and that it didn't mean we were abandoning them indefinitely.

The only thing I would add to the advice you've already gotten is to make sure you're putting him in his crate even when you're there, which it sounds like you may be, you don't want him to associate him going into the crate with you leaving. We have a rescue, 2-3 year old, that has been with us for a month now, he was not crate trained and still cries when we leave him sometimes. I'm home most of the time, but keep a routine of him going into the crate for a couple hours each day, the normal time I'd be away if out running errands etc. Now that he goes in his crate on command he doesn't get a treat every time, but occasionally he will get a "jackpot" of treats, this keeps them guessing... "Will this be the time I hit the "jackpot"?" And if we're leaving for any length of time he gets a Kong filled with peanut butter & treats.

Best of luck!
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ksheen
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ksheen

Female Join date : 2013-06-25

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PostSubject: Re: I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me.   I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me. EmptySun Jun 30, 2013 9:38 pm

When he is in the crate during the day can he see you or do you leave the room and let him scream? cause thats what balto does, even if I Am standing right there
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husky_drea
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husky_drea

Female Join date : 2013-06-30
Location : SoCal

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PostSubject: Re: I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me.   I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me. EmptySun Jun 30, 2013 9:46 pm

Now I can leave the room and he might cry, but that's it and it only lasts a short while. In the beginning though he screamed when I left, so I just did it little by little, sitting near the crate and moving further and further away each day and for longer periods of time. Our puppy, now 6mo, we rescued a few months prior had 2 crates, one in our room and one in the living room where she could see us and that seemed to work for her, but we never had any major issues crate training her, she now only has one in the living area because she still cries a bit at 2am, but will lay back down if we ignore her. The older rescue is in our room.
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ksheen
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ksheen

Female Join date : 2013-06-25

I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me. Empty
PostSubject: Re: I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me.   I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me. EmptySun Jun 30, 2013 11:15 pm

Okay, well today I did some training (Some sessions went better than others). He would sit there patiently and if he was quiet I would click and treat, or if he cried I would wait till he finished, waited a few, and then click and treat. What would me next step be because right now I am sitting right next to the crate and waiting until he is quiet and increasing the time he is in there. Usually this is where things go wrong, he usually starts getting upset and realizing that I am leaving when he goes in there, but he knows if he is in there at night it is because it is bed time. I am going to try for a few more days and see how he does, and on wednesday sadly I am going on vacation and my boyfriend will take over at his house but he is bonded to him just as much as me. All of this is helping and if there are any other tips it would help no matter what because I can't have him screaming in my apartment, don't think the neighbors would like that much ha
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NewComer
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Puppy
NewComer

Join date : 2013-06-10
Location : California

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PostSubject: Re: I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me.   I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me. EmptyMon Jul 01, 2013 2:29 am

Caper and I had this problem when we were preparing to move into our new apartment as well. He would sit right by the door and whine and howl when I left, so what we did was this:

I put up a baby gate so that he couldn't access the entrance hallway where he would go to sit to cry when I left. Then I picked a day where I didn't have to go anywhere and just practiced leaving over and over again until he got so bored and uninterested with me leaving that he would rather play with the toys I'd leave for him than run over to cry about me leaving. Steps to what I did:

1. Get lots of puzzle toys & treats that he likes
2. Hand him a toy or treat and tell him a signal phrase/word. Ours is "ok, I'm leaving now".
3. Move towards door and step over baby gate so he can't reach me. Then immediately turn around and return to him and give him a treat. Repeat until he doesn't get anxious anymore.
4. Move on to actually opening and stepping out of the door, but not closing it.
5. Repeat with stepping outside and closing door, but immediately returning.
6. Slowly increase time that you are "gone". Always treat when leaving and returning.

It also greatly helps to be able to see what he's doing right when you leave via a cam. I set up skype on my smartphone and computer so that I could watch him and re-enter the room only when he decides to do something other than wait by the gate for me. We fixed his separation crying in two training sessions over two days, and now he is fine with me leaving him for up to 4 hours alone (haven't tried longer and don't want to). When I finally bumped into my neighbors in the hallway a week after moving in they admitted they didn't even know I had a dog because he is so quiet Smile

For you, since you are using a crate, there might be some variation, like rewarding him by letting him out to be with you, but the basic desensitization is the same.

Good luck! Smile
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ksheen
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ksheen

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PostSubject: Re: I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me.   I have tried EVERYTHING... Please Please help me. EmptyMon Jul 01, 2013 10:31 am

So since you are using a baby gate, how big of an area does he have and does he go potty and tear things up where he is left because the reason I have to have him in the enclosed crate is because he will just rip things to shreds due to teething and he is potty trained but if I left him in a more open area I think he would go potty. I just did a crating session and sat farther from him and he did 5 minutes in with slight fussing (Whining maybe twice) and when he did I would look away and when he stopped I would wait about 5-10 seconds and click and treat him. Is this right?
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