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 Yuki Hoarding?

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Mobezilla
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PostSubject: Yuki Hoarding?   Thu Dec 13, 2012 1:26 am

Alright I've noticed this for a bit but I'm not sure how to correct it. I'm not even sure what 'it' is. Quite honestly, it just reminds me of the little sister always taking things from her sibling. If Cloud tries to get a toy, Yuki starts whining and runs over, pushes him out of the way, and takes the toy. If he tries to take another toy, she abandons the first toy, and does the same thing. If I'm trying to play with Cloud with a toy, Yuki has to shove herself in and tug on it too. Just now, Cloud was trying to chew on an antler and Yuki wouldn't let him have it, which of course turned into a fight (no biting, just lots of 'arguing'). I put Yuki in the crate with an antler and left Cloud out so he could have the other one. Then Cloud got ahold of a toy that he wanted me to tug-of-war with him. Yuki had a FIT. She started howling up a storm and digging at the crate door because Cloud and I were playing without her. Not sure how to correct this diva behavior, Cloud never acts like this towards her. He never tries to take her food or toys, and most the time if she wants a toy he will give it up, but it would nice to be able to let him enjoy himself a little too! xD Any advice would be helpful. (Oh, and as for food, they are fed at the same time but Yuki is fed in her crate while Cloud eats a few feet away. Yuki would steal his food too if I didn't make her go in the crate and sit and wait.)
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Mobezilla
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PostSubject: Re: Yuki Hoarding?   Thu Dec 13, 2012 1:40 pm

Bump please. She did it again this morning, taking a chew from Cloud almost as soon as he got it. Also, she tried to wake me up when she wanted fed this morning by jumping on the bed howling and digging at the blanket, scratching my legs and back. I ignored her for three hours, she did it four times in the time period. This isn't the first time this has happened. When I heard she was calm in her crate I got up, made her wait, and gave her her food. Not sure why she always acts like shes alpha when I've been training her since day 1 to sit before food, wait before the door, off the bed until I say ok, etc x.x I don't think shes in her teens yet but she is almost 5 months so could be, and I am consistent about the feeding in the morning at MY time (10am when she wants 7am) so I think with enough patience we can overcome that, its just the above post I'm worried about as I don't know how to correct it.
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Rocio_Caballero
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PostSubject: Re: Yuki Hoarding?   Thu Dec 13, 2012 2:01 pm

From what I can tell, she is being possessive with the toys and chews. You have to try exercises where she can learn that not all the toys are hers. Although, I've personally didn't have this problem for long so I can't tell you what to try Sad Hopefully someone can help you!
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Danzig's Mommy
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PostSubject: Re: Yuki Hoarding?   Thu Dec 13, 2012 2:08 pm

Danzig does this to Wyatt. He especially did it when he was a pup. With my two, since they're boys, I think it's a dominance thing. I've always just let him do it and eventually Wyatt learned to stand up for himself. Danzig is definitely dominant though.
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MayaAndSophie
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PostSubject: Re: Yuki Hoarding?   Thu Dec 13, 2012 2:19 pm

My girls do this but usually only when they're in a playful mood. Try taking toys from yuki and giving them to cloud then repeating the process. That's what I'm doing with maya and Kay, I just keep taking a toy from one and giving it to the other. They don't try to take food from each other because I don't allow it. If they get too close to one while they're eating I'll body block her till she gets the picture and goes away. I don't really know much since this is my first time owning multiple dogs so hopefully someone with more experience will chime in soon.
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Mobezilla
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PostSubject: Re: Yuki Hoarding?   Thu Dec 13, 2012 2:32 pm

@MayaAndSophie wrote:
Try taking toys from yuki and giving them to cloud then repeating the process. I just keep taking a toy from one and giving it to the other.

I'm already doing that lol its exhausting because I feel like I'm taking toys from her every 5 minutes.
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MayaAndSophie
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PostSubject: Re: Yuki Hoarding?   Thu Dec 13, 2012 2:42 pm

Hmm, then i don't know. Maybe try telling her leave it when she's about to go after a toy cloud has? If she already knows leave it which i think she does.
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Tika
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PostSubject: Re: Yuki Hoarding?   Thu Dec 13, 2012 2:43 pm

I wanted to respond to this this morning but it got lost in the shuffle of my routine, Sorry Megan.

As always We aren't there with you and can't see exactly what is going on, or the interactions and body language. All I can offer is my experiences with Ripley and hope it helps.


When we picked up Ripley we had already had Tika for about a year. Ripley we knew very little about apart from what we found out through Tori in the few days Tori had her. Obviously we were as prepared as we could have been when getting a new addition like that; that is to say NOT AT ALL.


Ripley came with baggage. Poor Health (Though fit her fur was a MESS and her nails / ear issues were just disgusting), Poor Training, Poor Manners. One of the first issues we had to deal with right off the bat was resource guarding / stealing when pertaining to bones and sometimes food. She never complained when a human put their hand close to her food, but as soon as Teek did there were a lot of teeth showing and warning signs.

If Tika had something she would stand over her and slowly push her head in and take it and then retort if Tika made a move. It's hard to explain but by standing over I mean that real intrusive assertive stand they can do. Essentially claiming the object.

If we tried to take bones away from her she would lock jaw on them and wrap her paws around them. She still at times gently wraps her paws around a bone if I try and remove it... She however drops it right away if I request so now and never lock jaws any more.




Dealing with the problem:

At first we tried to take the item away from Ripley and give it back to Tika... This didn't work at all. All it did was cause confusion and competition. In the end we also needed Tika to learn to stand her ground if she wanted something, and by us rewarding her every time Ripley took it away was teaching Tika nothing.


We moved onto removing the object entirely until the fixation from Ripley was gone. When we deemed it so we would then return the object to Tika. The punishment here is when Ripley would steal it the object was being removed from both of them and no one could have it for some time.


We also became very proactive at blocking Ripley's advances. Should she start towards Tika we would verbally warn her to stop, or at times even stand in between them, advancing slowly on Ripley until she sat or laid down. We rarely had to touch her (I'm a firm believer that a dog learns more if they do the action themselves instead of you touching them so I TRY and avoid it).

One of the best things we did for Ripley was actually to let her have a Bone and have Tika walk close to her. We would recall Tika as Ripley chomped away and correct her if she growled at Teek as she walked past. We even did this with our cat one night to really enforce that she could trust us to let her keep it when we had given it to her in the first place.


If she ever got really bad it was instant removal of object AND instant time out with a verbal reprimand. Rarely did we have to touch her unless she lock jawed, or moved in a way to really guard the object (Head over the object, frantic scrambling to get it in mouth, ect.) Fear and Guarding leads to bites, and I won't have that.


We never rewarded or gave an object back to either one without NILIF in mind.



Fast forward to today and it is night and day. Teek has grown a pair and will bark if Ripley gets too close and she generally just lays down or stands there wagging her tail... Ripley no longer guards or steals at all. Every now and then if we aren't watching they will eat each others food, but that is the exception and rarely happens.

I don't think we've had a scuffle over bones in at least 3 months, and the last one we did have was because of a very young Sharpe guarding one instead of Ripley. The Sharpe charged my dogs when they got too close and I stepped in front before they even made contact with each other (I was waiting for it to happen because I knew the Sharpe's behavior / training).




Anyways I've lived up to my Nickname again so I'll cut this here. I know this doesn't help with waking you up, but you can always try crating over night for that if it comes down to it.

In terms of guarding / hording you just have to be proactive and and insert yourself into the equation. Make it clear in the end you control that resource and you decide who / when they get it. If Ripley can learn it anyone can Razz

Hope it helps and hope you enjoyed the novel.
~Chris~


_________________
Is this about the cake problem? What's the matter with you mathematicians, cake is never a problem. - Professor Lazlo
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Mobezilla
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PostSubject: Re: Yuki Hoarding?   Thu Dec 13, 2012 2:54 pm

Haha thanks! I love reading novels here, Smile Yeah I do crate her at night. I had taken them outside around 6am and then went back to bed but didn't put her back in the crate x.x ugh tired me, remember to put her back in the crate lol. It does help because I prefer not to be scratched to death in the morning.. XD As for the taking of chews I do try to interfere before it happens but she literally RUNS over. She could be laying down, and she will hear cloud get up and she will whine and jump up, run over to him, shove him out of the way and take it into her crate within 5 seconds. So then I have to go into her crate which is supposed to be her 'safe place' and take the antler from her. Should I consider closing the crate door during the day, or would that be worse?
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Tika
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Male Join date : 2011-08-11
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PostSubject: Re: Yuki Hoarding?   Thu Dec 13, 2012 3:02 pm

Quote :
As for the taking of chews I do try to interfere before it happens but she literally RUNS over. She could be laying down, and she will hear cloud get up and she will whine and jump up, run over to him, shove him out of the way and take it into her crate within 5 seconds.


Let cloud have a chew and Umbilical her.

It gives you TOTAL control over the situation and your able to correct from a distance. Very good training exercise.

When she finally lays down politely beside you reward with affection or treats?

~Chris~

_________________
Is this about the cake problem? What's the matter with you mathematicians, cake is never a problem. - Professor Lazlo
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Mobezilla
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Location : Ohio

PostSubject: Re: Yuki Hoarding?   Thu Dec 13, 2012 3:16 pm

I've done it a few times, she whines like crazy on the leash inside but we'll have to tough it out, sounds like the best option. Will be doing this for the next three days as I'm off >:]
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