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 Inflamed Bowel Disease ???

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cmanding
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PostSubject: Re: Inflamed Bowel Disease ???   Sun May 13, 2012 10:21 pm

Fingers crossed!
Keep us posted!

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Andrw2121
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PostSubject: Re: Inflamed Bowel Disease ???   Mon May 14, 2012 12:05 am

YAY!!!

So Kodi loved the eggs and carrots and licked his bowl clean!!!!

His energy has increased tenfold today! He's seems back to his old self and is very playful, now fingers crossed we get a BM within the next 24hrs, and that it has some consistency.

I can't thank everyone enough for all your advice and concern.

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cmanding
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PostSubject: Re: Inflamed Bowel Disease ???   Mon May 14, 2012 12:15 am

Yay for appetite!
Fingers and paws crossed for a BM with some consistency!!!

I had Ginger on a 3-meal per day. I'm not sure if you have that opportunity but if you can't, then he'll need around 4-5 eggs and 1.5 c of carrots in the morning and at night. But if you can do 3 meals per day, it'll be better to get him regulated (if all goes well with this bland diet) until he's back on track then you can transition him to 2 meals per day.

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Andrw2121
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PostSubject: Re: Inflamed Bowel Disease ???   Mon May 14, 2012 3:15 pm

Great news... Kodi has had 2 BM's today! They have both been very small amounts, but they have consistency and you can pick them up off the grass!!! And no more straining!!! Definitely moving in the right direction.

We are going to start with the 3-meal per day suggestion. Today will be day two on boiled eggs and carrots. If all goes well we plan to continue this diet through Wednesday or Thursday.

After that, how should we introduce a new food? Any more thoughts on if we should try a pre-packaged raw diet, or start with a LID kibble. We'd like to stay somewhat cost efficient, but understand specialty foods can be more expensive. Can you break down again how exactly to transition him from his bland diet onto his new either raw/ LID kibble food? Should we try any other veggies with his bland diet to test for allergies before starting to look for his new food?

Hope everyone had a great weekend =)





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cmanding
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PostSubject: Re: Inflamed Bowel Disease ???   Mon May 14, 2012 4:45 pm

I am doing my BIG poop dance I did when Ginger had a good BM for the first time in WEEKS!!

I am so happy and relieved he seems to be moving in the right direction on this bland diet.

I personally would go 4-5 days on this bland diet, or at least until you have 2-3 days of good BMs. So, if today he produces a good BM, I'd continute this diet through Thursday, and then Friday start to SLOWLY introduce a new food, taking at minimum 3 weeks to completely transition him.

If you want to stay cost effective with what he'll end up on after transition, premade raw will be expensive, unless you plan to get meats from the grocery store and freezing them. Start to research what's available to you and what their price points are. If you need help to find a good food that is available to you, check out http://www.dogfoodanalysis.com/dog_food_reviews/showcat.php/cat/4.
I started at a 4-star rating dog food out of 6 star rating. See if Acana is available to you and if the price point is affordable. They are the same manufacturer as Orijen which is what both my pups are on. I'd also recommend you go grain free for now.

Come Friday, if he has been producing more normal BMs, you can start adding in whatever food you want try. If he is getting 4 eggs and 1 c of carrots, try decreasing it by 1 egg and 1/4 c carrots and add in 25% of what you would normally feed him in a day. So if you typically feed 2 cups of dry in a day, then each of your 3 meals in a day would consist of 3 eggs, 3/4 c carrots, and 1/2 c of kibble. If he produces BMs with the same consistency, keep him on this mix for another 3-4 days until you decrease his meal by 1 egg and 1/4 c carrots and then increasing the kibble by another 1/2 c. If at any time he goes soft, go back to previous mix and keep him there again until he resets and produces consistent BMs for another 3 days before trying a different kibble and starting with the 75%/25% mix.

This is where it'll be a trial in figuring out what he can and cannot tolerate. And it'll take time and patience. I think it was a good 6 months before I had Ginger's diet dialed in. And it was a lot of trial and error. But in the end, I know exactly what I can and cannot give her and how much she will tolerate certain ingredients up to a certain amount.

When you're looking for food/kibble to try, you may want to stay with a single source of protein. So if it's kibble, make sure the protein comes from either chicken, beef, or fish, etc. and not chicken and fish, or beef and fish. It's OK if you go with fish and it has a couple of fish varieties such as salmon and herring and cod in the mix.

What you could also check into is freeze dried grain free or dehydrated grain free. If he doesn't seem to take too well with kibble options you're trying, I'd suggest you look into either Grandma Lucy's, Sojo's or The Honest Kitchen, all of which have grain free options. I haven't met a dog that has turned their nose up to these type of food where you have to hydrate it. Just keep in mind that buying these types of foods will appear to be expensive to the size of the bag, but after you hydrate it, it comes out comparable to some of the better dry dog foods out there.

And then there's raw which can be very cost effective. Kristina can give you a lot more information on feeding raw as she has her huskies on raw. I have fed a partial raw diet in the past, but we need a bigger freezer because at one point, 75% of the meats in our freezer was for the pups!

I hope Kody continues to move in the right direction!
Keep us posted!


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Andrw2121
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PostSubject: Re: Inflamed Bowel Disease ???   Mon May 14, 2012 5:56 pm

Ok great we'll stick to the eggs and carrots for the rest of the week.

Side note: Kodi just had his 3rd BM of the day. This one was mainly a green mucus substance (Looked like snot from blowing your nose). He tried to go for about 10 sec then the mucus substance, then tried to go for a few more seconds before wiping his butt across the grass.

His mood and energy levels still seem fine. Any thoughts?
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cmanding
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PostSubject: Re: Inflamed Bowel Disease ???   Mon May 14, 2012 6:29 pm

If there is mucous in his BM, I'm wondering if maybe the eggs, or the yolk might be a bit rich for him since you're giving him 3 or 4 eggs 3x a day? Try taking away 1 yolk in each meal and see if the mucous goes away.

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PostSubject: Re: Inflamed Bowel Disease ???   Tue May 15, 2012 1:21 am

I think its time to remove the "In Training" from Claudia's title
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cmanding
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PostSubject: Re: Inflamed Bowel Disease ???   Tue May 15, 2012 9:53 am

Here4thePics wrote:
I think its time to remove the "In Training" from Claudia's title
Nah! I'm STILL in training! There's so much to learn out there that I'll always be in training! Smile
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PostSubject: Re: Inflamed Bowel Disease ???   Tue May 15, 2012 1:02 pm

My male was diagnosed with IBS....I kept him on Orijen and got some Perfect Form: http://www.thehonestkitchen.com/products/perfect-form/

I also use some probiotics, too.

Since he was diagnosed over a year ago he's been doing great (knock on wood) with his regular food and natural supplements!

Acana has new L.I.D. formulas now...if Orijen didn't work out for us I would probably go with the Acana LID, but for us, we were able to avoid changing foods (even though the vet said we should use a prescription formula and Predinisone)

arooroomom wrote:
Hi, welcome!

Sounds like quite the issue you have had on your hands. If those are the kibbles you have tried thus far, I would still look into thinking it was a food intolerance of some kind. I'm sure his tummy and intestines are quite the sight right now. I have been through the mill with Rodeo as well.., loose stool constantly with severe abdominal pain as well.

I would look into an adult formula (puppy ones are such a mess, ingredient wise) and go from there. If you are comfortable with raw feeding... That's where I would start. That was the first and only thing thus far Rodeo has been able to handle (natures variety instinct raw venison is where we started.) If not I would try some novel LID kibbles. I would initially start with a food that has just one meat protein source. Great Life grain-free is such a food I can name off the top of my head. I would begin feeding the food with a digestive aid such as perfect form or pumpkin...

Unfortunately tummy issues are for the most part trial and error... I feed raw to all of my dogs so that's what I recommend but I know most aren't informed or may not be comfortable.
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PostSubject: Re: Inflamed Bowel Disease ???   Tue May 15, 2012 1:48 pm

HarlosHealthyPets wrote:
My male was diagnosed with IBS....I kept him on Orijen and got some Perfect Form: http://www.thehonestkitchen.com/products/perfect-form/

Same here, our female chi has IBS and the ONLY thing that works for her is Perfect Form (and yes, we tried everything from switching foods, probiotics, yogurt, pumpkin, bland diets, LID diets, etc). She cannot live without Perfect Form, that stuff is a life saver!

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Heather!
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PostSubject: Re: Inflamed Bowel Disease ???   Tue May 15, 2012 1:50 pm

I'd think your dog had colitis. Rogue got it when we started feeding her raw elk we got from a friend who hunted and it was a lot of diarrhea with mucus in it- the elk was far, far too rich for her and her stomach was just a hot, hot mess.
I just changed proteins after letting her stomach empty and fed her canned pumpkin. Obviously colitis can be caused by IBS though.

We use PF on our dogs as well as love, love, love it. We use 3 THK supplements.. haha.
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Here4thePics
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PostSubject: Re: Inflamed Bowel Disease ???   Tue May 15, 2012 3:19 pm

cmanding wrote:
Here4thePics wrote:
I think its time to remove the "In Training" from Claudia's title
Nah! I'm STILL in training! There's so much to learn out there that I'll always be in training! Smile

Life is always about learning .........the day I stop wanting to learn something new will be the day I die.
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Andrw2121
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PostSubject: Re: Inflamed Bowel Disease ???   Tue May 15, 2012 3:53 pm

Yay!!! Firm poops again this morning! He's going less frequent as well, about 2-3 times a day, compared to the 4-6 when he had the runs.

I stopped by our local pet food store and picked up some of the THK Perfect Form. I plan to mix some in with his lunch today. I'll let you know how it goes.

If all continues to go well (knock on wood), we plan to introduce his new food Friday. After doing some research, and reading comments/reviews on here I think we are going to try THK. The pet store today had samples of Embark, Love, Thrive.... Which one should we start with or should I try and get samples of one of their other products (Like Zeal or Keen)?

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cmanding
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PostSubject: Re: Inflamed Bowel Disease ???   Tue May 15, 2012 4:17 pm

If he has firm BMs, I'd hold off on Perfect Form for now, but keep it handy just in case he will end up being one that absolutely needs it. I bought Perfect Form for Ginger, but didn't need it because she firmed up on the bland diet. This also helped me figure out what she could tolerate. If you add it now, you *might give him an ingredient that might not agree with his tummy which would make him go a little soft, but on Perfect Form, his BM goes firm.

If you're going to try THK, go with Force. It's grain free chicken and it has Ca:P ratios that's food for puppies (1.59:1).

Their other grain free formulas are (for future reference):
Love = grain free beef
Embark = grain free turkey
Zeal = grain free fish (but most expensive formula)


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brady.law
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PostSubject: Re: Inflamed Bowel Disease ???   Tue May 15, 2012 6:15 pm

I would definately look into adding a pro biotic in the mix
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cmanding
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PostSubject: Re: Inflamed Bowel Disease ???   Tue May 15, 2012 6:30 pm

Probiotic did not help my female at all. It would firm her up for the first 24-48 hours and then she went soft again. Pumpkin helped her firm her up for the first 24-48 hours, then she went soft again. I even tried a mix of pumpkin and probiotic and that only worked for the first 24-48 hours until she went soft.

My experience has been that probiotic or yougurt will help but it's a temporary resolution to soft BMs. And on occasion, if your pup usually had normal BMs it good to give yougurt with active cultures to help promote the healthy bacteria or help 'reset' their digestive tract.

Just my

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PostSubject: Re: Inflamed Bowel Disease ???   Wed May 16, 2012 5:20 pm

Andrw2121 wrote:
Yay!!! Firm poops again this morning! He's going less frequent as well, about 2-3 times a day, compared to the 4-6 when he had the runs.

Yesterday you reported he had firm BMs again....is he still producing firm BMs today?
Just checking in....
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Andrw2121
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PostSubject: Re: Inflamed Bowel Disease ???   Wed May 16, 2012 7:31 pm

Hi, thanks for checking in on us =)

Kodi is still improving!! He passed more firm stools this morning around 5am. He had another breakfast and lunch today of eggs and carrots and still gobbles it right up.

I picked up a 4lb box of THK Force this morning from the local pet store. They were super friendly and even gave us a few samples of the other formulas. He even said if Kodi has any issues on Force, to bring back the opened dog food and he'd exchange it for another "flavor".

His energy levels seem to keep climbing as each day passes. I can't thank everyone enough for your help and support with this issue. I'll keep everyone posted once we introduce Force and let you know how Kodi likes it. =)
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cmanding
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PostSubject: Re: Inflamed Bowel Disease ???   Wed May 16, 2012 7:36 pm

Good to hear of his progress!
I haven't heard of a dog turning his nose up to THK yet, so hopefully he continues to do well as you transition him slowly to Force.

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PostSubject: Re: Inflamed Bowel Disease ???   Thu May 17, 2012 3:25 pm

Hi everyone!!!

Kodi is still having firm BM's.... and this morning he had his firmest one yet!!!!!!

He still gobbles up his eggs and carrots.... fingers crossed he loves THK Force just as much =)

Had a side note questions about treats and rawhide:
Obviously treats can set off a dogs stomach as well. Are there any treats you guys recommend us trying or using?

What about rawhide? He seems to love them, but I know in my mom's lab it can cause diarrhea. Or are there any rawhide alternatives you would recommend?

Bones or other chew toys your dog can't live without that Kodi need to try lol

Thanks again, hope everyone is having a great week =)
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mbarnard0429
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PostSubject: Re: Inflamed Bowel Disease ???   Thu May 17, 2012 3:40 pm

Personally, I would never give rawhide. There have been too many horror stories involving it. Instead I give elk antler. They last way longer and are way safer.

Our dogs love treats, typically we use zukes mnis for Cato's training http://www.naturalk9supplies.com/Dog-Treats/zukes-mini-naturals.aspx

and for everything else we use Zukes Hip Action.

http://www.naturalk9supplies.com/Dog-Treats/zukes-hip-action-dog.aspx
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PostSubject: Re: Inflamed Bowel Disease ???   Thu May 17, 2012 4:02 pm

With Kodi's sensitive tummy, I would wait to try new treats for the time being until you can get him transitioned to Force. Once you have him transitioned to Force and he continues to do well, I would stick with that protein, chicken. Since you already know he is OK with carrots, you can give him raw baby carrots as treats for now.

Once you get him transitioned to Force, you can slowly introduce new treats that has either one or two ingredients listed in them. This will be easy on his tummy and if he goes soft, you'll know what ingredient is causing his tummy upset.

If you go to naturalk9supplies.com, they have treats that I give my two that they absolutely love (and they are about $4 less than retail but use BARK10 to get an additional 10% off your total)!:
http://www.naturalk9supplies.com/Dog-Treats/free-range-dog-chews-chicken-breast-wraps-carrot.aspx

This will be a good one to start if he is doing well on Force. It is dehydrated, and it is only chicken and carrot - two ingredients you know he will be fine on!

They have others that are chicken wrapped apple and chicken wrapped banana - apples and bananas should be OK for Kodi.

You can also do freeze dried treats:
Chicken:
http://www.naturalk9supplies.com/Dog-Treats/grandma-lucys-freeze-dried-just-chicken.aspx
Fish (and this will tell you if he can handle fish or not):
http://www.naturalk9supplies.com/Dog-Treats/grandma-lucys-freeze-dried-just-ocean-white-fish.aspx
Venison (again, this will tell you if he can handle venison):
http://www.naturalk9supplies.com/Dog-Treats/grandma-lucys-freeze-dried-just-venison.aspx

The above will give you an idea of what proteins he'll be able to handle once he's regular with firm BMs! The above treats are also what I introduced to my female once she was regulated and since they are only 1 ingredient, I would easily find out if it caused tummy upset. Most huskies I know will do well on venison so hopefully, Kodi will too!

Natural K9 Supplies also has dehydrated sweet potato chips that you can try for Kodi:
http://www.naturalk9supplies.com/Dog-Treats/grandma-lucys-sweet-potato-thins.aspx

Again, only one ingredient and it'll tell you if he is OK with sweet ptoatoes and if he is, you can get these too!:
http://www.naturalk9supplies.com/Dog-Treats/free-range-dog-chews-chicken-breast-wraps-sweet-potato.aspx

The idea here is to try treats with as little ingredients as possible so that if he goes soft, you can easily identify what is causing his tummy to be uspet. These are all what I started on with my female too when I finally got her regulated.

As for chews, my female did very well on Zukes Z-Bones. They don't last that long, but it'll slowly introduce him to other treats:
http://www.naturalk9supplies.com/Dog-Treats/zukes-z-bones-dental-chews.aspx
You can get the carrot flavored and/or apple ones to start.

My female also did really well on himalayan chews!:
http://www.naturalk9supplies.com/Dog-Treats/himalayan-dog-chew.aspx
And they are made up of only 4 ingredients and it'll be a good chew for Kodi to start on.

Those should get you started once you start to get him regulated on Force.

But for now, until he is at least 50% half bland diet and 50% Force, hold off on introducing too many other ingredients to his diet.

It'll take time, but patience will be in your favor - you're making good progress right now and I'd hate for you to take a step back because you introduced one too many new things in his diet too fast.

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brady.law
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PostSubject: Re: Inflamed Bowel Disease ???   Thu May 17, 2012 4:17 pm

I avoid rawhide like the plague. It's hard to digest for dogs who don't have sesative stomachs. Also, kiara wasn't crazy about taste of the wild, I started adding all natural grizzly salmon oil http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B0002ABR6E/ref=mp_s_a_1?qid=1337282207&sr=8-1 and she eats it right up!!

It's frustrating,most people know rawhide isn't the best but pet stores and feed stores carry mostly rawhide treats and bones.
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Andrw2121
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PostSubject: Re: Inflamed Bowel Disease ???   Thu May 17, 2012 6:13 pm

Thanks for the quick replies. Sorry I should have mentioned this was for down the road once his tummy settles down.

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