After many tests, I suspect osiris has early symptoms of IBD. Going to the vet on Monday to confirm. If diagnosed, does anyone have any suggestions on the best food for IBD dogs that's non "prescription"? He's currently on wellness limited ingredient salmon and potato. Not sure if I should keep him on that while he takes meds or switch to something else, possibly raw?

What are the symptoms? You mean Irritable Bowel Disorder (?) ?

Yes. He has soft stools, (formed but definitely mushy) and occasional mucus as well. He has been on tylosin for 4 weeks for SIBO but I haven't seen much improvement in his stool. One or two days it will be perfect and then it will revert back to softly formed. He will occasionally throw up bile, or will have a rumbling stomach (never at the same time though). I want to get him started on IBD treatment just to see how he responds.

How old is he? How much food does he get daily, including treats?

4 year old in tact male. 44.4 lbs full grown. No weight loss, but no weight gain. Here's some pictures from another post a while back

https://www.itsahuskything.com/t12425-does-osiris-look-skinny-or-underweight-to-anyone

Right now hes only eating 2/3rd cup in the morning and 3/4-1 cup in the evening. Both servings mixed with 96% lean cooked ground beef to mix in bitter tylosin. He doesn't eat much I guess. He had high folate levels in his GI tests so doctor suspected he has SIBO and put him on the tylosin. He also had a TLI level of 50, which normal range is like 5-45 so its not terribly out of the ordinary. It's like he has the opposite of EPI (if that even makes sense).

How long has he been on tylosin and has the vet done a fecal recently?

* to be more specific, has he tested positive for bacterial infection or parasites in the stool test, and if not, why is he on an antibiotic (tylosin)

Ok well, there is a handful of folks on here who are savvy with dietary medical issues so hopefully they jump in. I just wanted to set up the questions they'd inevitably ask you.

He's on banfields special needs plan. He gets all his comprehensive exams every 6 months, all vaccines, in depth urine and fecal exams, he's on trifexis monthly. Dental cleanings once a year and i have 3 xrays to use before the year is up. (Might just do it just to do it and see what comes up) blood work all normal minus folate levels and TLI.


Also, he gets no treats ever. (Lol)

He's been on tylosin for 4 weeks because the vet suspected he has overgrowth of bacteria in his small intestines. His stool was better for a bit but now its back to being soft. I have a hunch he has a partially inflamed small intestine causing the food not to be absorbed properly.

To be honest with you, to me it sounds like either salmon doesn't agree with him, or the protein level is too high for him. I had ongoing issues that were very similar with my dog when he was a young pup. It was so bad my hubby and I started calling him squirt (you're welcome for the visual) and carried water bottles instead of poop bags for a while. Now, we still ask each other, did Dizzy do you a solid? Lol. Anyway, really the only thing that finally got him consistently solid was going to a lower protein food and then eventually going raw. I got him fully switched over in late september and last month decided to try kibble again, because, lets face it, it's just a lot more convenient. After a few days on kibble, the stool went soft, his eyes got all gooey and mucasy and he developed a hot spot. I tried a couple different foods, and none were better than the other. So, I've realized that he's just going to require a raw diet for the rest of his life.

I very much doubt your dog has IDB and I think it's worth trying a lower protein food or raw if you so desire. For dogs, there is a difference between food allergy (itching) and food intolerance (diarrhea, stomach upset). Dizzy can't really handle fish, especially white fish, he also has issues with chicken. I think you are jumping the gun a bit to go in for testing for IDB and treatment just to see what happens. It's just my opinion, but if the stool is clear of parasites and bacteria, I would assume there is a food issue.

I would also suggest a probiotic, I used gastriplex when Dizzy was having his ongoing issues.

I want to try raw so bad, and I asked my vet to put her doctor hat aside and give me her true opinion on raw. She said as a friend and not a doctor, its great. Only problem she said its terribly time consuming to prepare raw and make sure he's getting all the nutrients he needs day by day.

With that being said, would you mind tuning me into your routine for dizzys feedings? What kind of raw meat, veggies, fruits? How much? And should I start with cooking it fully first and slowly reducing the amount cooked until its fully raw?

I know there's a lot of info on raw food on the internet, but I'm always skeptical considering I have beliefs that my dogs digestive system isn't up to par to handle full on raw.

There's no amount of money or time I won't put down for my dog. If raw works, ill do it.

Well I do prey model raw and essentially have been just buying whatever meat at the store I can find that is under a certain price and allows some variety in his diet. I don't add any veggies or fruits, but do give him carrots, sweet potato leather (thanks jeff ), and various fruits as treats. He eats 1.25 lbs a day, but is a bit thin, so I'm going to increase it to 1.5 for a while. He weighs 48 lbs currently. So a typical week might include turkey thighs, pork spare rib tips, beef/pork liver, beef ribs, veal ribs, kidney, beef heart, basically anything I can find onsale. Thanks to another forum member I recently did my first order with someone who actually makes and sells her own raw food called pawfectly raw new england. I'm picking up my first order tomorrow. Her mixes include the correct balance of meat, bone, and organs, so it will take the thinking out of shopping and planning his meals.

I also tend to disagree that it will take you tons of time to plan and shop and prepare. If you go to the grocery store once a week and own a freezer, you're about 90% the way there. I switched Diz cold turkey, and that's normally how people switch. There is no need to cook it, and definitely don't cook bone because it could splinter and cause serious issues. You'll be amazed the first time you see your dog crunching right through pork bone without a problem.

The stickie for raw on this forum has a lot of great info. I'm very happy to answer any questions as well, but that has more of an in depth description of the different types of raw diets, like BARF, that does include cooked veggies.

Here is a link to the stickie I was talking about.

https://www.itsahuskything.com/t1256-considering-a-raw-diet

Thank you so much I will consider that! We have a local pet store that has pre packaged raw food 95% meat bones and organs and 5% fruit and veggies ground down into a kibble form. I was considering this because knowing my luck/anxiety I have a feeling my dog will choke on the bones or get one stuck in his throat. Only thing is the pre packaged raw is 34.99 for a 4lb bag!

I have a food processor I was considering using to ground whatever meat, fruits and veggies together so he eats it all at once.

Are bones absolutely needed? I would prefer to hold off on that if possible.

Bones are absolutely, 100% necessary for calcium and for him to have a solid stool. I'm walking home now but I'll check back in later tonight and give you some more info. I can also take a video of Diz eating bone tonight if you'd like me too.

Sounds good thanks!

I don't have a ton of time tonight between brushing out a massive amount of coat from Diz and getting ready for an insane weekend, but here is a really horrible quality video of Diz eating a pork spare rib. You can hear him crunching right through the bone. He's a very happy dog right now. He's had both veal and beef ribs as well and never had an issue with either one.

Read some of the links in that thread I posted and then come up with some questions and I'll tackle them when I can. Most likely, that won't be until Monday when I go into work, go figure.

Anyway here you go, Dizzy eats a spare rib:

Hi Kooms!

I registered just to reply to this, and my pup is a golden not a husky. I have the same problems you do!

1. my 3 yr old female has grown up with bouts of diarhea and sometimes vomit. Found that Tylan was effective but after the 6 week treatment, the problems would come back! The vet thinks she just has nervous tummy and associates it with stressful (even fun excitement) situations. In general it seems like her tummy is rigid sometimes - like you can feel the muscle so not sure if it's a tummy ache/gas.

I just ordered Gastriplex and will see if it helps.

Honest Kitchen's perfect form does work but once you stop using it, the problem is back.

2. I'm also down for raw but concerned if dogs with compromised immune system/tummy issues should be in raw. Thoughts here?

jolieqe1 wrote:

Hi Kooms!

I registered just to reply to this, and my pup is a golden not a husky. I have the same problems you do!

1. my 3 yr old female has grown up with bouts of diarhea and sometimes vomit. Found that Tylan was effective but after the 6 week treatment, the problems would come back! The vet thinks she just has nervous tummy and associates it with stressful (even fun excitement) situations. In general it seems like her tummy is rigid sometimes - like you can feel the muscle so not sure if it's a tummy ache/gas.

I just ordered Gastriplex and will see if it helps.

Honest Kitchen's perfect form does work but once you stop using it, the problem is back.

2. I'm also down for raw but concerned if dogs with compromised immune system/tummy issues should be in raw. Thoughts here?

I dont feed raw yet, and do know as much as i would like. But im pretty sure raw is great for a dog with sensitive tummy. Im sure people who have more info of raw will chime on though.



Also from the OP a lot of your symptoms sounds a lot like koda when he was younger. After trying 5 different foods in a few months. I figures out koda was allergic to turkey. Right when i changed him off his food with turkey, he was fine. No more mucus in his eyes, or runny poop.

jolieqe1 wrote:

1. my 3 yr old female has grown up with bouts of diarhea and sometimes vomit. Found that Tylan was effective but after the 6 week treatment, the problems would come back! The vet thinks she just has nervous tummy and associates it with stressful (even fun excitement) situations. In general it seems like her tummy is rigid sometimes - like you can feel the muscle so not sure if it's a tummy ache/gas.

I just ordered Gastriplex and will see if it helps.

Honest Kitchen's perfect form does work but once you stop using it, the problem is back.

2. I'm also down for raw but concerned if dogs with compromised immune system/tummy issues should be in raw. Thoughts here?

My late Faith had irritable bowel and we tried everything with her.  Perfect Form was the only thing that worked for her. But, like you said, you can't stop using it or the problem comes back.  I kept Faith on Perfect Form as long as we had her since nothing else worked.

Raw should work for dogs with sensitive stomachs since it's what their bodies are made for.  However a dog with irritable bowel isn't exactly "normal" so it may or may not work.  We tried Faith on raw multiple times to see if it would help her and it was a huge step back each and every try.  Her system just couldn't handle it and we were forced to return to dehydrated raw (The Honest Kitchen agreed with her) and Perfect Form.

I strongly encourage you to try raw, you'll never know how your dog will fare unless you give it a try.  My only reason for sharing my experience is to make people aware that even raw may not be the answer for dogs with IBD.

Hello!

We had/have the same problem. we tested for EPI, but it came back negative. but his stool did come back positive with giardia.

We were able to get the soft stool under control though. We are feeding Nature's Variety LID Lamb formula, 1 probiotic pill every morning, and 4 teaspoons of coconut oil daily.

One thing that we think has really helped with his bowel movements is smaller meals. Instead of 2 meals a day, we feed him 4 small meals a day.

he just got the all clear from giardia (yay!), and has put on 2 lbs in the past 2.5weeks. Our vet had suggested that we go see a specialist to get him tested for IBD too since it's been so long since he gained any weight. But now that he is starting to gain weight again (at least we hope so), we may wait on that a bit.

Have you tried a different LID food that isn't fish?

So, a quick update. I switched Orisis to raw. I feed him prepackaged Natures Variety Raw Instinct bites. It is working a lot better than kibble! He still gets small bit of looseness but overall the firmness is at least 85% better! I got the formula with a bunch of apples, carrots among other things, which I think wasn't the best option (plus it's the most expensive). The petstore carries other brands as well with 95% meat, bones, and organs and 5% pumpkin. I may switch to that to avoid all the excess fruits and veggies (and it's less expensive). All in all, raw is much better for my dog so far. But time will tell! Also, I may try the raw dehydrated and see how that works out.

I'm also starting to think he doesn't have IBD but more of a food intolerance.

jolieqe1 wrote:

Hi Kooms!

I registered just to reply to this, and my pup is a golden not a husky. I have the same problems you do!

1. my 3 yr old female has grown up with bouts of diarhea and sometimes vomit. Found that Tylan was effective but after the 6 week treatment, the problems would come back! The vet thinks she just has nervous tummy and associates it with stressful (even fun excitement) situations. In general it seems like her tummy is rigid sometimes - like you can feel the muscle so not sure if it's a tummy ache/gas.

I just ordered Gastriplex and will see if it helps.

Honest Kitchen's perfect form does work but once you stop using it, the problem is back.

2. I'm also down for raw but concerned if dogs with compromised immune system/tummy issues should be in raw. Thoughts here?

Also, did you slowly reduce the dosage of tylan? Or did you cold turkey stop? I did 1/8th tsp 2X / Day for 6  weeks then reduced it 1/8th tsp 1X / day for 6 weeks then 1/8th tsp 1X / every other day for 6 weeks.

kooms wrote:

jolieqe1 wrote:

Hi Kooms!

I registered just to reply to this, and my pup is a golden not a husky. I have the same problems you do!

1. my 3 yr old female has grown up with bouts of diarhea and sometimes vomit. Found that Tylan was effective but after the 6 week treatment, the problems would come back! The vet thinks she just has nervous tummy and associates it with stressful (even fun excitement) situations. In general it seems like her tummy is rigid sometimes - like you can feel the muscle so not sure if it's a tummy ache/gas.

I just ordered Gastriplex and will see if it helps.

Honest Kitchen's perfect form does work but once you stop using it, the problem is back.

2. I'm also down for raw but concerned if dogs with compromised immune system/tummy issues should be in raw. Thoughts here?

Also, did you slowly reduce the dosage of tylan? Or did you cold turkey stop? I did 1/8th tsp 2X / Day for 6  weeks then reduced it 1/8th tsp  1X / day for 6 weeks then 1/8th tsp 1X / every other day for 6 weeks.

Yeah, for the many bouts of Tylan it was always 1/4tsp twice a day for 3 weeks, then every other day, then every 2 days, etc til she was weaned off. After she's off of it, the average it take for mushy mucus poop to come back is about a month It's usually when something exciting happens - play date with her best friend, visitors coming over, etc.

On a side note, for those whose pups have tummy issues - does anyone notice any rigidness in their tummy area? It's like I can feel her "6-pack" and wondering if that is normal. To me it feels hard (the area right by the ribs)

anyways, not trying to hijack the thread but did have all the symptoms of the original poster.